Please close thread

[orionismycat]

It is a source of frustration that you can't search for auction posts by subject i.e. Rapunzel or ending soonest/newly posted. The fact that auctions can vanish into page 3 or 4 in a matter of a few hours means it's difficult to spot new auction posts and they are sometimes missed. I propose that when the new server arrives new functionality is looked at for an upgrade. Make it possible to search for auctions by character,date order of original posting and ending soonest. This would help prevent this problem happening in the future. That said in this instance, as sad as it is the auction did get a bid and in my opinion as such has been won. Rest assured pin karma does exist.

 

[kupo1121]

Auctions don't get buried on eBay, when someone looks up Disney pins everyone's posts get equal treatment. Finally, eBay is a business, we are a community of traders, many whom we consider friends.

I think this is not true imo On Ebay, they match up your search text with the pin, as closely as possible, it is a good system. However, recently I saw a grail Stitch pin sell for close to half of what it usually sells for because, and I cannot figure out why, no matter how I searched it, the pin ALWAYS appeared at the very bottom of the list when I searched for the pin, often appearing on Page 3, 4, or 5 depending on how many pins you viewed on one page. The only time I managed to get it on Page 1 was when I searched exactly as the person had mentioned it and then only a handful of pins appeared including that one.

The problem with Ebay that DPF doesn't have is that Ebay doesn't allow bumping so auctions like that get lost at the bottom of the listing and the seller can do nothing about it

I think there is a loophole and an opportunity for people to take advantage of others willingly. It wasn't as if the person placed a bid, and nobody else wanted it. The person deliberately, although within their own rights, decided to wait until the last second, because they didn't wasn't others to see the post in time.

I do not see that as "taking advantage of" I actually see that as being a smart tactician. I do this all the time on both Ebay and if I sometimes bid on DPF. The whole concept behind bidding at the last second is because you don't want to give time to anyone else to see your bid, analyze it, and try to match or beat it. I think it is one of the smartest things because if you bid your bid early on, you nearly always get outbid I find, putting it at the end, rarely. That's just what I've found after doing it many times so I continue to do it. While we do do it willingly, it really isn't to cheat you out of your pin, but I do it to cheat the other bidders from seeing my bid

Also, I do enjoy how civilized this conversation has been

 

[Robins Hood]

People may argue, we get too much for certain auctions, yet, that is a choice the bidders make.

Thanks everyone for keeping this civilized.

i hope your not implying you are ok with people overbidding for pins but when it comes to underbidding its wrong. Because I know more than a few that get pretty upset when people over bid for pins on this forum due to the auctioneer knowing how popular a pin is making a post prior to the auction about trading it and speaking interests to ignit bidding wars.

 

[Mahrii]

It is a source of frustration that you can't search for auction posts by subject i.e. Rapunzel or ending soonest/newly posted. The fact that auctions can vanish into page 3 or 4 in a matter of a few hours means it's difficult to spot new auction posts and they are sometimes missed. I propose that when the new server arrives new functionality is looked at for an upgrade. Make it possible to search for auctions by character,date order of original posting and ending soonest. This would help prevent this problem happening in the future. That said in this instance, as sad as it is the auction did get a bid and in my opinion as such has been won. Rest assured pin karma does exist.

Agreed, well said!

 

[docfish2u]

I also think the bid should be honored. I am sorry that your auction got buried, but as the auctioneer it is your responsibility to make sure it gets exposure by bumping it (although only once a day please!!!).

I would not have a problem with the three bidders rule. However, I cringe every time I hear somebody mention snipping. I just have not seen that happen very often and again, it is a chance we take when we put something up for auction.

I do not like the minimum value reserve mentioned however. Who decides what the value is? That is too subjective in my opinion.

 

[Mahrii]

i hope your not implying you are ok with people overbidding for pins but when it comes to underbidding its wrong. Because I know more than a few that get pretty upset when people over bid for pins on this forum due to the auctioneer knowing how popular a pin is making a post prior to the auction about trading it and speaking interests to ignit bidding wars.

Nope, no idea what you are referring to.
Not saying under or over-bidding is wrong or right, that is not the topic. People bid whatever they want, that's their choice. I don't want to turn into that topic.

 

[broncobilly83]

Two bids? Did I miss one? Running over to check.

Well, if it is the auction I am looking at, you had 2 bids from different users, one at 11:29 PM and one at 11:33 PM, my time. Seeing as your auction ended at 11:30 PM, I do not know if you count the other bid

 

[Bryana]

Unfortunately I agree with the others that it should be honored. I know it sucks but you kind of dropped the ball on making sure your auction received visibility.

I like the idea that if an auction does not get a minimum number of bids then the auctioneer can choose to not choose a winner. I, personally, like the idea of 3 bids but 2 bids would suffice.

I do not agree with reserves in any format. If there is a reserve or stipulation, then the auctioneer can say I only want pins from my wants list. I only want LE pins. I only want my grails, etc. This would open up a can of worms as it would be too easy for the auctioneer say that the pins do not "meet their standards" and not choose a winner.

Since we are on the topic of auctions I would like to propose a couple other things.

1. Auctions do not last longer than X number of days. Personally I think 4 days is quite sufficient. I think auctions that go one a week or more is just way too long.

2. Auction end times should be no later than 9 pm PST. I live on the east coast and believe it or not I have gotten up at 2:50 am EST to check an auction that ended at 12:00 am PST to see if I needed to add anything to my bid. LOL! Now is it my problem that I wanted a pin so bad that I got up a 3 am? Certainly. However, I think it would be a kind gesture.

 

[Zagales14]

I placed the second bid. It was late, and I had just seen the auction, so it was a desperation bid to try to get something in and then offer her something on top of that in private if she decided to choose me even with my late and low bid.

I had not seen the auction. However, I completely understand if she discarded the bid as late.

As to the initial issue, I agree that the bid should be honored, as I find it the seller's responsibility to promote and ensure exposure to the auction, however, this situation presents a clear loophole that needs to be protected. I wouldn't go as far as making a 3 bid minimum, but I would place a time restriction like: If there are no bids on the auction at 1 hour before it's end, the seller/auctioneer has the right to withhold the pin from any bids placed within the last hour.

Those are my 2 cents.

 

[docfish2u]

Unfortunately I agree with the others that it should be honored. I know it sucks but you kind of dropped the ball on making sure your auction received visibility.

I like the idea that if an auction does not get a minimum number of bids then the auctioneer can choose to not choose a winner. I, personally, like the idea of 3 bids but 2 bids would suffice.

I do not agree with reserves in any format. If there is a reserve or stipulation, then the auctioneer can say I only want pins from my wants list. I only want LE pins. I only want my grails, etc. This would open up a can of worms as it would be too easy for the auctioneer say that the pins do not "meet their standards" and not choose a winner.

Since we are on the topic of auctions I would like to propose a couple other things.

1. Auctions do not last longer than X number of days. Personally I think 4 days is quite sufficient. I think auctions that go one a week or more is just way too long.

2. Auction end times should be no later than 9 pm PST. I live on the east coast and believe it or not I have gotten up at 2:50 am EST to check an auction that ended at 12:00 am PST to see if I needed to add anything to my bid. LOL! Now is it my problem that I wanted a pin so bad that I got up a 3 am? Certainly. However, I think it would be a kind gesture.

I love the maximum amount of days for auctions. That would keep the current auctions a lot smaller.

But what about the overseas people? It sucks that you have to get up in the middle of the night, but for the overseas people it is much worse.

 

[orionismycat]

Not forgetting those across the pond who regularly sit up until 4am waiting for an auction to end!

 

[orionismycat]

Thanks Docufish2u

 

[Bryana]

But what about the overseas people? It sucks that you have to get up in the middle of the night, but for the overseas people it is much worse.

Good point! I wasn't thinking of our overseas members. Sorry about that and yes....a decent time for all of us.

 

[jazzytrumpet]

I think the auction should technically be honored because of the "rules" DPF has set for trade auctions.

Maybe DPF can modify their Trade Auctions rules. Allow a "reserve" or "minimum bid" requirement.
OR if possible, make Trade Auctions - SILENT Auctions. No one sees the specifics of who bid what. The seller can post the leaderboard (and maybe note how many pins or what types of pins [DA, DSF, LEs], but not give specifics). That way, bidders don't have to swipe in last minute to try to outbid others or not show their bids. True, it's a tactic on eBay and in this auction, but I don't agree that that tactic is in the spirit of Trading and being a community.

 

[Mahrii]

I think this is not true imo On Ebay, they match up your search text with the pin, as closely as possible, it is a good system. However, recently I saw a grail Stitch pin sell for close to half of what it usually sells for because, and I cannot figure out why, no matter how I searched it, the pin ALWAYS appeared at the very bottom of the list when I searched for the pin, often appearing on Page 3, 4, or 5 depending on how many pins you viewed on one page. The only time I managed to get it on Page 1 was when I searched exactly as the person had mentioned it and then only a handful of pins appeared including that one.

The problem with Ebay that DPF doesn't have is that Ebay doesn't allow bumping so auctions like that get lost at the bottom of the listing and the seller can do nothing about it



I do not see that as "taking advantage of" I actually see that as being a smart tactician. I do this all the time on both Ebay and if I sometimes bid on DPF. The whole concept behind bidding at the last second is because you don't want to give time to anyone else to see your bid, analyze it, and try to match or beat it. I think it is one of the smartest things because if you bid your bid early on, you nearly always get outbid I find, putting it at the end, rarely. That's just what I've found after doing it many times so I continue to do it. While we do do it willingly, it really isn't to cheat you out of your pin, but I do it to cheat the other bidders from seeing my bid

Also, I do enjoy how civilized this conversation has been

Yes, I too must say that it is refreshening to see the conversation handled so well.

I don't know if I'm making myself understood though. The only reason I say taking advantage of, is because in your example, you are not suggesting offering a hidden mickey or rack pin. I would make a bid that is comparable in trade value or close to it.

Just so that its understood, I am not planning on cheating this person out of their pin. I am not honoring the auction, but the person will get the pin. Mainly because, pin karma does go around and my intention is not to hurt anyone. Besides, there is far much more generosity in this forum than greed, from my experience. I rather be part of the generous group.

Had I just intended to keep the pin, I would have kept quiet and cancelled the transaction, taken my loss, and infraction and no one would know. Or very few people would have. I have seen auctions cancelled , terminated early for other reasons, with no problems.

So taking the issue of honoring or not honoring the auction out of the equation, as I have heard your opinions loud and clear, and I respect them. Could we look at the possibility of creating a rule for FUTURE auctions, of three minimum bids?

I have brought this idea up many times in the past and everyone has always agreed it is a good idea. Are there any other possibilitites.?
This is not something that would require any major change.

 

[docfish2u]

Thanks Docufish2u

Watching out for my peeps overseas!!!

 

[kupo1121]

I don't know if I'm making myself understood though. The only reason I say taking advantage of, is because in your example, you are not suggesting offering a hidden mickey or rack pin. I would make a bid that is comparable in trade value or close to it.

Oh! I see what you mean, yes, I can see where bidding just an HM or rack pin is wrong. In that case, I believe it could be remedied if, let's say for a pin of the caliber you were putting up, in the OP you put in big, bold letters "bids consisting of just rack pins or HMs will not be accepted." While I understand it will deter some, it won't for all. This prevents people from putting up just HMs or OEs and makes it paramount to include at least 1 LE pin in the mix

I have brought this idea up many times in the past and everyone has always agreed it is a good idea. Are there any other possibilitites.?
This is not something that would require any major change.

It is an idea that needs work, you are right, I would love to see a way to make the whole Auction section similar to Ebay. Before putting it up you have to include a few things into your auction that decides which category it would go under to make it easier to search, categories could include:

Characters (this section could ask you check off boxes where your pin fits into, all characters that appear on that pin would obviously mean their movie fits the bill)

Edition (this section would merely ask if the pin is HM, OE, or LE)

Origin (helps for those only looking for recent DSF releases, or pins from certain parks or online)

And then we could obviously title the auction whatever we pleased so people know what pin they are looking at. It is like a mini-Ebay (how they ask you to set up the auction) if we could do something like that. I am not forum savvy enough to know if that is possible but it would no doubt help people search for pins.

 

[mickeymousje]

Watching out for my peeps overseas!!!

Thank you! I totally agree, it's almost 1AM over here and I miss a lot auctions because I can't bid on them because they end at the middle of the night my time. I just can't wake up for it because of my meds otherwise they won't work and well that isn't important right now
I am very sorry Maritza this has happend and agree with everyone else like yourself I also do hope there will change some rules for the auctions, a minimum of 3 bids sounds good to me as well as the ending time and how long a auction might take

 

[drb195]

IMO, The auction rules are not appealing to me, and thus I do not participate in them. You should not zap the person the pin, you should just make the trade and honor the auction. I see people suggesting 3 bid minimums, which is the same as a reserve to me. I see ebay used as examples on here, and on ebay if one bid is made then it wins. Period. I also saw a suggestion to end bids 5 minutes prior to auction close. that is a ridiculous idea, because then the auction is over 5 minutes sooner than the posted time. what if someone is typing trying to get their bid in and it is a pin you desperately want? what will stop you from honoring that bid because you really want it. I think you need to own the fact that you let your own post get buried, and as a result, you only got one bid. If you kept up on your post and kept refreshing it, then more people who said they would have bid, actually might have. Own your fault in what happened and take your medicine like an adult and honor the trade.

 

[anzaryaa]

i agree on the fact that there should be a minimum amount of bids in an auction.

 

[kupo1121]

Just to help out those who are located somewhere else in the world, how could we make it so that auctions end at a fair time for all? I mean, given the world is covered by pin traders, it isn't really possible to find an exact time that works for everyone. I'm not sure how that would work in the end since the only thing I can think of is an auction where it ends 4/1 at 9am wherever you live (so no matter where you lived on 4/1 at 9am it would end) but I find that unfair because those who reach 9am last get an unfair advantage

snip

Hey drb,

let's try to please keep this civil here as it has been already. Mahrii has already stated numerous times that she is going through with the deal which is very gracious and rule-abiding on her part as it should be so I cannot help but feel like your constant "own up to this like an adult" is trying to start unnecessary drama

 

[fishgal]

Okay I'm new here and still picking things up, but here's my question. I don't see what a minimum of three bids does to fix the problem you encountered. They can still all be low end last minute bids there is nothing that really would insure that bids were noticed in time etc. Not trying to be mean or anything, honest. But it really seems like its the auctioneer's responsibility to get the auction seen and the bidders responsibility to try not to have it seen by a lot of people.

I'm not really familiar to this forum system yet, is there a way to schedule forum posts like you can with blog posts? So you could schedule "bump posts" in advance to get better viability? This might help an auctioneer that doesn't intend to check in on his/her auction to get better visibility. Though there would be no way to know if your scheduled bump posts would time out with someone elses and get bumped under the pile again. Tough deal. Well I'm off to learn more about how this all works, hoping i don't find out that i've put my foot in my mouth with my suggestions, but as i said, i'm new

 

[kupo1121]

Okay I'm new here and still picking things up, but here's my question. I don't see what a minimum of three bids does to fix the problem you encountered. They can still all be low end last minute bids there is nothing that really would insure that bids were noticed in time etc. Not trying to be mean or anything, honest. But it really seems like its the auctioneer's responsibility to get the auction seen and the bidders responsibility to try not to have it seen by a lot of people.

While this may happen with 3 bad bids, I can't help but feel like with at least 3 bids, the auction will be constantly getting bumped by those bids, a leaderboard by the auctioneer, and the auctioneers bumps as well. This increases exposure tremendously. On top of that, here are some other pros:

- Those 3 bids will obviously want to beat out each other so I doubt we'll get 3 equally bad offers, at least one of those is going to try and top the others by adding a better pin they can't keep up with, helping it keep up with the auction format of best bid wins

- It is unlikely that one auction will just happen to get the attention of only 3 people who bid bad pins in the first place without one of those people bidding a fair bid.

- It is up to the auctioneer to determine whether or not they want to implement the 3 bid minimum rule, if they don't want to they don't have to ^_^

 

[docfish2u]

Okay I'm new here and still picking things up, but here's my question. I don't see what a minimum of three bids does to fix the problem you encountered. They can still all be low end last minute bids there is nothing that really would insure that bids were noticed in time etc. Not trying to be mean or anything, honest. But it really seems like its the auctioneer's responsibility to get the auction seen and the bidders responsibility to try not to have it seen by a lot of people.

I'm not really familiar to this forum system yet, is there a way to schedule forum posts like you can with blog posts? So you could schedule "bump posts" in advance to get better viability? This might help an auctioneer that doesn't intend to check in on his/her auction to get better visibility. Though there would be no way to know if your scheduled bump posts would time out with someone elses and get bumped under the pile again. Tough deal. Well I'm off to learn more about how this all works, hoping i don't find out that i've put my foot in my mouth with my suggestions, but as i said, i'm new

Welcome!!!! I hope you enjoy your time here!!!

 

[Mahrii]

This goes to show, that we are able to hold great conversations, with differing point of views.

I think that although some of the ideas are different, we all do agree in that its not a bad idea to try to do something.

Personally I like the ideas of:

1. Setting a minimum of 2 or 3 bids.
2. And, or if no bids within last 30 to 60 minutes before the auction, to have option to relist.
3. I love the idea of max number of days, its hard to follow auctions that are too long.

Finally, what are PM bids? I received a couple of PM bids but wasn't sure what they are. I have heard the term used, but do we allow people to bid through PMs?

I'm so proud of how everyone has handled this conversation.