Rant from a CM at DLR about APs buying too many duplicate pins

[Spectromen]

So I was at Pin Traders on Thursday night picking up the Mermaid PODH. I got the usual nighttime CM with the long blonde/grayish ponytail, always very friendly and cordial. She goes to slide my AP for the discount and sort of snickers and says to herself, "I wish they'd...." and didn't finish. I said, "What's wrong, is the register going slow?" and she says no, that they're getting ready to impose the same rules on APs as they do on CMs. When CMs buy the CM-only pins at their Team Centers, their purchases are recorded by their I.D. and they can't buy more than the stated limit. So she says they're planning to roll this out on APs, so that if an AP tries to buy more than 2 of the same pin with their pass it will alert them that they can't buy any more.

Her irritation was probably sparked by about 5 of us in a row buying 2 each of the PODHs. The two guys in front of me both said they weren't passholders when asked. Not to stereotype but I found that hard to believe - they "looked" like typical traders and locals and perhaps were circumventing the limit of 2 thing by paying full price, which may have sparked her ire. But whatever.

I was at first thankful to hear this rumor but then she proceeded to get a little angry, warning that "You signed a contract when you bought your pass that says you will not purchase any merchandise to re-sell and once this is in place Disney will take your pass from you right then and there if you're found to be buying more than the limit". She then started giving the example of how many thousands of guests come from all over the world and spend thousands to stay in the Disney hotels and expect to be able to buy the latest pins that come out during their vacations and can't.....whereas us APs snatch them all up and "only give us 500-600 bucks a year".... and went on from there.

She pretty much crossed the line of tact right there for me, but I'm non-confrontational, and simply said, "Wow - you're going to be dealing with a ton of complaints really soon" and she didn't seem to be worried.

I issue I can already hear from the hardcore buyers/traders is that "How does Disney know what I'm doing with these pins? Maybe I'm just trading? Maybe I'm buying extras for all my family members across the country", etc etc etc, basically negating the possibility that they're going on ebay.

Should make for a very interesting mess.

This was the first I'd heard of this - anyone else heard it before? Could it only be a rumor to discourage APs from buying so much?

 

[mylittletyguy]

This can go in so many directions. If Disney is so ticked about it...then maybe they should offer their pins for sale online the day of the release, instead of 30 days after....so EVERYONE would have a chance to buy instead of people visiting that very day or the locals that live nearby.

 

[dis22]

I think a limit of 2 per AP is a good idea, but people will still find a way to purchase more....unless they say to provide whatever pass/ticket that you used to enter the park. If they do that, then people will only be able to purchase 2...which is a great thing. Those AP holders that try to purchase more than 2 will be forced to show their pass and it will already say that they got 2. Trying to pay full price after getting 2 with AP won't work.

 

[stitchfan1015]

DisneyStore already does that, and even though the site says, "only one per person" people are able to get their hands on as many as they want. Example: Designer Villains

Regardless of what system they put in place, people will find a way to exploit it...

This can go in so many directions. If Disney is so ticked about it...then maybe they should offer their pins for sale online the day of the release, instead of 30 days after....so EVERYONE would have a chance to buy instead of people visiting that very day or the locals that live nearby.

 

[bjean]

hmmmm ... maybe but I'm having a hard time with this concept as Disney is in the business of making money and has NOT carred about the secondary market for pins, up to now. They care about conterfeit pins, trademark infringement and scrappers being sold from manufacturer to private individuals as Disney is not making ANY money from these types of situations. I really don't see Disney enforcing a 2 pins per AP beyond the initial release of the pins. Storage and warehousing of such merchandise becomes very expensive, very quickly. They may have something like this put into place for a limited time after each "new" release ... but if the pins don't all sell out quickly, I can see Disney releasing that limitation and allowing people to buy as many as they want. Just some thoughts from an old-time pin collector, lol! (and someone who used to work with warehouse costs, etc.). Take care, *bjr

 

[Mali87]

Huh that would be interesting if Disney did somehow do that w/ APs... it would prolly piss many resellers off... but as always people will find a way around it I'm sure.

In regards to her remark about how if some buy a bunch of pins and they (Disney) only gets $500 to $600 something from us... that would have upset me a bit. Their pass is expensive!!!!! Even w/ a payment plan. I believe as long as I don't go all nutty all buy over 25 to 30 of a single pin (can't even buy 2 at time most times bc I am broke as joke atm), I should be able to buy as many pins I would like. Plus, they're getting our money either way!!! Why would it matter to them? Disney prolly makes soooooooo much money off of pins alone bc they are priced so expensively too.

Hmm... I think the CM is tired of dealing w/ Pin nazis.... I don't mean to offend anyone but some (not all) pin traders are very mean to CMs... I sometimes don't blame them for holding a resentment for having to deal w/ us. The CM was pretty ballsy saying those comments to a guest though... notttt exactly Disney friendly... (their guest services has gone wayyy down imo since I was a CM in 2005). When I was a CM they choked good guest service down our throats.... now some CMs are just mean too! So I guess it goes both ways.

I have come to realize pin trading is much like politics: u can't please everyone no matter how much u change the rules, and ppl will always find some way(s) around the rules if they do change XD lol

 

[bombardon3]

That was unprofessional of her to rant to a guest. I can't complain about them cracking down on buying multiples since technically they're just enforcing a rule that has always been in place but not enforced. Rumor has it they're cracking down on FastPass abuse later this month too so it looks like they're tightening up on a lot of fronts.

 

[matt24256]

I think I had the same female cashier Thursday evening. She went into the same rant about how soon annual passes will track how many you buy and limit you to 2. I just smiled and agreed with her. She was basically saying she didn't want our business. I chuckle when people complain about making money.

But my thoughts are that most tourists arent after the 'new' pin. They want a momento. If Disney was so concerned about the out of town visitor they would focus on scrappers. How upset do you think an out of town guest would feel after they spent $30 on a 6 pin booster set to trade with cast members and only get the fakes that are on most of their lanyards. Its even worse when they buy rack or mystery pins and trade them away.

 

[Romancing_Train]

Virtually what they're doing is cracking down on the DISCOUNT people get. Disney stocks and what not are actually going down and the company is actually been losing money for a few years.

AP price increases, fewer perks, these things will just help them make more money.

If they do check your ticket/pass every time you buy, it also means people without these things could possibly buy in DTD several times if the pins survive longer then a day or two.

From what I've heard at DSF, there are many many complaints all the time from out of town people wanting to get special pins when they come, something out of the ordinary, to remember the occasion. When the Pin traders snatch them all up, this hurts the people from out of state.

This might be how Disney is going to counter that too at the Parks. Pins may not be the biggest merchandise but I know hundreds of people who collect them at one point or another and if they went on a holiday and there was a LE holiday pin they'd probably want that more too. It makes more people happy.

When I was a CM there was also a lot of rude pin traders. I loved doing it but some days I'd meet 2 or 3 and put my lanyard away because I didn't like the way they'd talk down to me. CMs have feelings too...

It's not good that this CM (Annnnddddd I'm pretty sure I know who it is) said these things out of frustration when you did nothing wrong. But maybe it's a good thing too to start spreading the word

I'm alllll for the pins going up online. Although it will probably never happen...Pins bring people to the parks which brings more money to them....just saying.

 

[CoryTheRaven]

Her rant was unprofessional, but it sounds like a symptom of the ongoing struggle of Disneyland to deal with the tensions between the notoriously low-spending regulars/AP holders and the spend-crazy tourists. I'm in the latter class myself, so I dare not speak either way, but I have had other situations where a system being exploited by locals has ruined it for those of us who aren't (*cough*VMK*cough*). The price of a pin is more or less the same either way: it's the experience the tourist is going to bring back with them (and tell others about) that makes the difference.

 

[imp]

I don't have a problem with a limit on how many you can buy with the discount, but how/why would you stop people from buying more at regular price? You'd somehow limit AP holders but not others? (I'm assuming these aren't AP pins) In practice, this would only affect higher edition sizes anyway.

 

[mylittletyguy]

DisneyStore already does that, and even though the site says, "only one per person" people are able to get their hands on as many as they want. Example: Designer Villains

Regardless of what system they put in place, people will find a way to exploit it...

No they don't. I don't recall being able to purchase anything released that was LE from a Disney website, or anything from the DSF for that matter. Unless you camp out and are physically there, there are a lot of pins you cannot obtain unless you are physically there, therefore making it impossible for the majority of people that live no where close to the parks can obtain these, unless it IS on the secondary market.

 

[bretu]

We lost our %20 discount at WDW in january. Just %10 now. I will no longer be purchacing an extra pin to trade. What is the discount at DLR?

 

[Romancing_Train]

I don't have a problem with a limit on how many you can buy with the discount, but how/why would you stop people from buying more at regular price? You'd somehow limit AP holders but not others? (I'm assuming these aren't AP pins) In practice, this would only affect higher edition sizes anyway.

If it's in park they may add a system where they ask for your entrance ticket and scan that. So if you buy 2 any anyplace on grounds that's your two. If you cannot buy a ticket and aren't AP the only place you could buy from is DTD and since most CMs that work there work in shifts you'd have to wait out and hope the second shift morning person, afternoon person and night person don't remember you. Otherwise you could come back.


I believe all pins are 2 per VISIT. Which basically means everyone could go one day and are welcome to come back the next day. But with that it means A LOT more pins will be going to the general public.

 

[imp]

I know this wouldn't be popular with local traders, but if Disney really wanted yo shut down the purchase-for-profit business, and ensure that pin buyers are the people spending who are spending money in their parks, the only way would be to sell LE pins ONLY in the parks and limit buyers to 2 per park ticket. Frankly, I'm surprised that they still produce very low LE's and sell them at moderate prices, since the profit margins must be quite low and they may even lose money on them. .

 

[docfish2u]

We lost our %20 discount at WDW in january. Just %10 now. I will no longer be purchacing an extra pin to trade. What is the discount at DLR?

depends on the pass you hold. The premium pass in currently 20% I think and the others are 10 according to the Disneyland web site.

 

[Lamorak]

Hmmm... So the idea is to sell less pins to individuals in the hope that more people will buy more pins overall? I somehow don't see anyone actively resolving an issue of selling too much merchandise. Isn't it the goal to sell a lot of merchandise quickly?

If they do this, I see this panning out as a release day restriction. You can only buy the two pins per day on release day or some small number of days following release day. If you want more than your two pins, come back tomorrow. After the initial release; anything goes.

Just my opinion, but Disney isn't going to implement any long term policy that will kill off sales.

 

[dizneyfanaddicts]

depends on the pass you hold. The premium pass in currently 20% I think and the others are 10 according to the Disneyland web site.

That is why they said WDW in their posting, Disneyland is still 20% for preminum and 10% for the others but WDW is not it is 10%.

 

[Psycho Pixie]

I see 2 issues with this....

firstly: Passholders will get around the rule by paying full price and not showing their pass if necessary to get more than 2. If they buy them at full price, with no passholder contract, there is nothing Disney can do to stop them from reselling at a mark up. Even if a passholder bought 2 with the discount, and 2 full price, Disney cannot say they cannot resell 2 of the pins. And the legality of preventing them from selling the other 2 is sticky. Asking for a drivers license would not work either.

Second: Once a pin is purchased, just like any other item, it is your pin. You own it. What you do with it from that point on cannot be controlled by the previous owner/retailer. Disney can control the mark up and resale of Disney products by Cast Members simply by putting a clause in their employment contracts, policies and procedures. Regardless of purchase price, even if a CM buys without their discount, they cannot sell the item for more than they purchased it for or they can be fired. ((correct me if I am wrong on that one))

I think putting a limit of 2 per pass (giving you the discount on 2) is a great idea. And completely enforceable with the pass. However, it will not stop people from buying more than 2 pins.

 

[Romancing_Train]

I see 2 issues with this....

firstly: Passholders will get around the rule by paying full price and not showing their pass if necessary to get more than 2. If they buy them at full price, with no passholder contract, there is nothing Disney can do to stop them from reselling at a mark up. Even if a passholder bought 2 with the discount, and 2 full price, Disney cannot say they cannot resell 2 of the pins. And the legality of preventing them from selling the other 2 is sticky. Asking for a drivers license would not work either.

Second: Once a pin is purchased, just like any other item, it is your pin. You own it. What you do with it from that point on cannot be controlled by the previous owner/retailer. Disney can control the mark up and resale of Disney products by Cast Members simply by putting a clause in their employment contracts, policies and procedures. Regardless of purchase price, even if a CM buys without their discount, they cannot sell the item for more than they purchased it for or they can be fired. ((correct me if I am wrong on that one))

I think putting a limit of 2 per pass (giving you the discount on 2) is a great idea. And completely enforceable with the pass. However, it will not stop people from buying more than 2 pins.

Second is correct.

BUT there is no way of Disney to know you aren't selling your extra two. So if you buy two and sell your other two, disney doesn't know you bought those other two through other methods and thus could still net you a broken pass.

 

[Lamorak]

I think that all too often a lot of people focus on the negative aspect of why people are gathering a multitude of pins. Sure. There are those that gather them to sell on eBay and whatnot. But there are still plenty of others who are picking up multiple pins for all their trading partners that may not be located within a convenient distance from any of the parks.

Just look at any of the threads where a new pin is announced and all the people asking if someone could pick them up a pin.

If Disney implements this restrictive policy, the people who are going to suffer the most are those who have been reliant upon those who are able to get multiples of these pins. The eBay people will be ecstatic, since their pins are more likely to be bought by those whose regular means of acquiring pins has been cut off.

So.... A policy change that is supposed to hurt resellers will actually benefit them. What else is new?

 

[latemetal]

This rumor has popped up time and time again since the beginning of pin trading in 1999. Don't see it ever happening. If they are concerned with purchasing limits, they lower the number of stores its in. It works and no new pricy system to put in at every location and train all the cast members on it.

DisneyStore already does that, and even though the site says, "only one per person" people are able to get their hands on as many as they want. Example: Designer Villains

Regardless of what system they put in place, people will find a way to exploit it...

With regards to the Designer Villains set, it was "Limit one per order." Never stated one per person, one per account, one per address. It was one per order. If people bought multiple orders, they were within the rules. Just like at the parks, LEs are limit 2 per day. If someone buys 2 and buys 2 the next day, no rules were broken.

 

[dis22]

Sell LE pins online. Everybody would have an equal chance to purchase the pins on their own. No overnights, no lines, no mad rush, no trying to get somebody to get the pins for you, no drama/arguments about who's purchasing pins or how many they are getting. Announce the releases online, sell the pins online (2 per person)...everybody who cares about a particular release would know about it and place their order online. If they're too late and miss out, so be it. If the pins don't sell out online, put them in the parks after a week. If Disney cares about pleasing the majority of their customers, a majority of their customers are away from the parks. I agree that there are very nice people who purchase pins for others at cost. Some purchase an extra to trade. Yet, when you see the rising #'s of pins being sold both before and immediately after a release, it's ridiculous. The argument of the resellers simply going online with fake accounts or having family/friends purchasing for them doesn't really hold up because that happens now at releases.

 

[BigDaddyAshton]

I really don't think it was her place to rant.

 

[Vixy]

OMG we had that same CM when we were there last month. We had *just* upgraded to AP's *that evening*, and I bought two of the Pirates PODH pins and asked whether the limit was two per person period. She said, "No, it's two per day." I said "Ah, okay, thanks." Then she added rather grumpily, "...but of course you could just go on to another pin store after you leave here and buy two more and I'd never know..." and I said "oh, I don't want to do that. I can wait until tomorrow." and she proceeded to rant for roughly the next ten minutes about people who abused the AP and how Disney would track them and they'd get a letter revoking their AP and on and on... every time I would sort of make a sympathetic comment like "mhmm" and "yes, I hate it when people abuse the system" she just kept on getting angrier and angrier. My friend felt like she was accusing *us* of being these people (even though we clearly weren't buying excessive amounts of any one pin.) She went into that same part about people coming from all over the world being unable to buy pins, too; I'd forgotten that until I read your post.

I'm not entirely sure I believe it's a real thing, since it's clearly both this CM's pet peeve and current line of rant-- and since her story apparently varies a little, because she told us that the rule was *already* in place, and that people who bought too many AP pins were already being tracked and would get a letter revoking their AP.