Going to try this for Third time Adivce on a Bad Trade

Okay here it goes this was my original post last night. On March 31st I made a trade thru TA. I traded my pins 78016 and 71255 for pins 73184, 79643 and 76781. I sent my pins with DC. After 3 weeks I still hadnt received my pins. I emailed the trader and the response was he mailed them but not with any tracking and he didnt think that it is his responsibility to make sure they are delivered. I was floored as I thought it was the responsibility of each trader to make sure their pins arrive (Which is WHY I use DC). After go back and forth with this trader I finally asked that he either replace the pins, find a different set of pins that were equal in value or to return my pins. He refused all of it. I did file a complaint with TA and Pinpics as of yet he will not give them info on sending any pins. I filed a complaint for mail fraud. Still I am out the pins. I dont feel I can leave negative feedback on here even though the trader is a member here because I didnt make the trade here. I am at a loss as to how to resolve this or what my next step should be. I have had 2 trades go bad in 10 years and when they go bad boy do they go bad. I had a package of my pins not make it to a trader (before I used DC) I replaced the pins as I see it as my responsibilty to get them there. So what should my next move be? What would you do? And please lets not have more attacks it childish.

i think your taking all the correct steps,i mean what else can you do.you've reported them to pin pics and mail fraud.i dont think theres anything else that can be done.maybe in the future you can ask a trder if they could please make sure they ship w/a dc so this doesnt happen to you again.once again im so sorry this happend to you.

Actually just spoke with Bev from pinpics and the situation is a little how to I say it? Hmm well lets just say I have found he is an "older" gentleman and very forgetful so I guess Lesson learned always request DC. I am now going to have to go and unfile the mail fraud as I just cant do that to a senior citizen And yes the moderators at pinpics actually care I couldnt believe Beth called me all the way from canada to help resolve it.

Ugh, I'm sorry to hear this issue is going so poorly.

I'd definitely leave the individual a neg here. I don't want to be trading with this person. I leave DPF refs for people all the time, regardless of where the trade was organized.

-JD

Gloomy said:

Ugh, I'm sorry to hear this issue is going so poorly.

I'd definitely leave the individual a neg here. I don't want to be trading with this person. I leave DPF refs for people all the time, regardless of where the trade was organized.

-JD

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+1

So far, IMO, you have done the right things. You've notified Pin Pics and filed a mail fraud charge against this trader. I also would recommend keeping all emailed correspondance between you and this trader until this situation is resolved; you might need those emails to support your case with Pin Pics, mail fraud, or (likely) both.

But I still would leave the negative feedback for this trader here because people need to be aware that this trader is problematic. Anyone who checks his/her feedback rating will see this negative feedback and will know what happened - and might be cautious about trading with him/her - or might not make any trades at all. I've noticed that there is an onslaught of, shall we say?, problematic traders lately ... and I think part of the reason is because of Dizpins closing. While Dizpins was operating, the mods/admins maintained very strict rules about pin trading - and if you broke those rules, there were consequences - and those consequences were enforced. Now that Dizpins no longer exists and new sites have emerged (and while Pin Pics still will help settle problems, I believe it has decreased the role it plays in monitoring/policing issues), the pin traders who were kicked off Dizpins for problematic/unethical trading practices are coming out of the woodwork, setting up screen names on the newly emerged sites, and likely continuing to trade the way they did that got them banned from Dizpins in the first place.

Before you 'remind' me that this trade didn't happen here, it happened through Pin Pics (I hadn't forgotten), let me ask you a question: when you made trades through Pin Pics that went well, did you use the Reference Center attached to Dizpins to leave positive references for the traders? I would argue that it's the same situation. The Reference Center isn't attached to Pin Pics, but you probably still used it ... right? And sometimes completely new traders without references at all will ask traders to check their eBay feedback scores until they have time to build up references of their own pin trading. I see nothing wrong with leaving a reference (positive, neutral, or negative) here for a trade that happened on Pin Pics - especially since Pin Pics doesn't have its own feedback system. And, honestly, that's what the feedback system is for - to let other traders know what kind of trading experience you've had so they can make an informed decision about whether or not they want to deal with any given individual.

Regardless of if you do not press charges, do leave a negative feedback at Pinpics stating that you did not get your pins and for others be careful. I still can't imagine any trader saying it is not their responsibility after sending pins and yet not even attempt to offer proof that he sent them even a reciept. Do be careful in the future and be specific on mailing. It might.

Sorry to hear abut your bad trade. I agree with everyone else that says you did everything right. I would leave negative feedback even if you didn't set up the trade here. I leave feedback for trades that were set up through PinPics here if I find out they are members all the time.

I am really worried that even though this person is a very old man and "forgetful" that others will have the same thing happen. Bev assured me he is an honest trader but sometimes forgets what he trades and doesnt really understand alot of things. She even said he probably shouldnt be trading. So that only leaves me with leaving the reference here as people cant see complaints on pinpics. should I leave it as neutral or negative? Ugggh now I am conflicted on what to do.

I follow the rule of thumb that if the transaction happened on Pinpics then I leave a reference there and if it happened here then the reference goes here. I have only made an exception a couple of times for people that were new here but I knew them to be good traders on Pinpics. I have even been asked before to leave references in both places, but I'm sorry, I won't. To me that seems like padding the references in a way.

I also think the positive feedback is being somewhat abused here. I know this will be an unpopular opinion, but I don't think people should be leaving positive references for zaps. It just doesn't seem right to me. Sure, give someone free stuff and of course the are going to be happy with it. But the point of the feedback system is to measure someone's reliability to follow through on their obligation to complete transactions and a zap is neither an obligation nor a transaction. Isn't the whole point of a zap to do it out of the kindness of your heart anyways? I just think it really skews the numbers...

Wait a minute. To get back to Tabbitha's point, Just because someone is "old and forgetful" a trader should get a pass?

You should definitely leave a negative and be truthful in your response on that negative. People need to be warned before they decide to trade with this person.

No they shouldnt get a "pass" however I just feel bad for him. I cant help that as that is part of who I am. Yes Old people, kids and puppies I am a softie on as I was a kid once and I will be old sooner than I like. And well who doesnt like puppies? So I am going to have to think about this some more. But everyones opinions are VERY helpful as I dont want to just react.

Remember that despite any legitimate forgetfulness, this person had the nerve to tell you it wasn't his responsibility to ensure that his pins arrived. If he gave you a legitimate apology and tried to fix the situation, sure, don't leave him a negative. But to wrong you and then basically tell you, "tough luck"? I mean, I understand having sympathy for him and his situation, but translating that sympathy into not giving him a neg... 'Just seems like he's taking advantage of you, you know?

Like you, I send all my domestic stuff with D/C, specifically because it IS my responsibility, and I don't want to wind up having to replace a missing package. This person's skimped on that cost for who-knows-how-long, and is now expecting you to foot the tab. Seems like total garbage to me.

-JD

So I can say I suffer from memory loss and not send trades and its all good?
I feel bad for people like this but call it like it is. Not a good thing and it can happen to you.
People should be aware. Regardless of the reason a trade goes bad, it went bad.
So as long as its not my fault it is ok? So I give my pins to my kids to mail and they forget or lose them. It was not my fault, right, or is it.

It is an agreement and if you are aboe to commit to it, you need to follow it through to completion.

Bottom Line, NO EXCUSES. Old, forgetful, whatever, a bad trade.

See? Even a different old forgetful guy agrees. ^_^ LOL

-JD

OKAY DAN lol I get it I am being tooooo soft as usual I will do the correct thing and leave the feedback. You are my little voice of reason

Wow!

You are such a great trader.. I think it's terrible that someone would take advantage of you like that..

I don't believe it.. Forgetful, my @$$!

If a trader on any pin forum is consistently making bad trades or deals, they need to be banned. :nono:

Really, if a senior citizen can't drive safely, they get their license taken away.. :shock:

If a senior citizen can't make good trades, they need to get banned! Sorry! :squint:

Thank you every one for all of the advice I did decide to leave the feedback on here as I couldnt live with it if i didnt say something and it happened again to one of you
Tabbi

Ok, here is my two cents worth, although they are pretty much worthless. :-(

I recently did a trade with someone from here (DPF) and I always send viaDC. My choice. Well I received his pins, wonderful and I check my DC that Isent and it showed they were delivered. A few days later I wrote to this personto make sure he was happy with the pins he received (I actually sent an extrapin he did not know about because I felt that the pins he sent me were toogenerous). Needless to say, the trader mentioned that he did not get thepackage. He did however say that sometimes he has trouble getting his mail, forvarious reasons, and not to worry about it.

I immediately filed a complaint to the USPO, which of course went nowhere,but I wanted to see what happened to the package.

The trader checked with his carrier as well, but with so much mail andsubstitute carriers, nothing came of it.

As the pins were not received, it was my responsibility to make sure theyDID arrive.

I then posted a thread on here asking for everyone's help as I was not aboutto let this pin trade end this way.

To me the trade is not complete until everyone receives the pins promised.

I purchased one pin off EBay as it was a harder one to get, and then someoneon here was generous enough to trade me for the other one I needed.

I then was heading to D-Land and asked to meet up with this trader and hegladly did so.

He now has the pins promised and we are both happy with the trade.

Was it my fault the mail was lost, No!

Was it my fault that there are issues with delivery in the trader’s area,NO!

It IS my responsibility to make sure the pins arrive, even if it meanssending them twice.

It is kind of you Tabbi, to "Forget" this trade and go on, but nomatter what you decide, the trade is not finished until both parties receiveand are happy with the pins promised.

I am glad I did what I did, because I know that the other person is happywith our trade. I know have a good relationship with a trader that is awesometo deal with, online as well as in person!

Again just my two cents worth.

Vicki

iamdisneydan said:

So I can say I suffer from memory loss and not send trades and its all good?
I feel bad for people like this but call it like it is. Not a good thing and it can happen to you.
People should be aware. Regardless of the reason a trade goes bad, it went bad.
So as long as its not my fault it is ok? So I give my pins to my kids to mail and they forget or lose them. It was not my fault, right, or is it.

It is an agreement and if you are aboe to commit to it, you need to follow it through to completion.

Bottom Line, NO EXCUSES. Old, forgetful, whatever, a bad trade.

Click to expand...

Even though im late giving advice, I agree with Dan completely! Sorry this happened to you! I do think this guy is out of order and that Bev, even if she means well shouldn't be siding with him due to "old age", he's obviously competent enough to arrange trades because he made the trade with you in a way that you didn't suspect he was forgetful or not "with it" lol!

huertajv said:

Ok, here is my two cents worth, although they are pretty much worthless. :-(

I recently did a trade with someone from here (DPF) and I always send viaDC. My choice. Well I received his pins, wonderful and I check my DC that Isent and it showed they were delivered. A few days later I wrote to this personto make sure he was happy with the pins he received (I actually sent an extrapin he did not know about because I felt that the pins he sent me were toogenerous). Needless to say, the trader mentioned that he did not get thepackage. He did however say that sometimes he has trouble getting his mail, forvarious reasons, and not to worry about it.

I immediately filed a complaint to the USPO, which of course went nowhere,but I wanted to see what happened to the package.

The trader checked with his carrier as well, but with so much mail andsubstitute carriers, nothing came of it.

As the pins were not received, it was my responsibility to make sure theyDID arrive.

I then posted a thread on here asking for everyone's help as I was not aboutto let this pin trade end this way.

To me the trade is not complete until everyone receives the pins promised.

I purchased one pin off EBay as it was a harder one to get, and then someoneon here was generous enough to trade me for the other one I needed.

I then was heading to D-Land and asked to meet up with this trader and hegladly did so.

He now has the pins promised and we are both happy with the trade.

Was it my fault the mail was lost, No!

Was it my fault that there are issues with delivery in the trader’s area,NO!

It IS my responsibility to make sure the pins arrive, even if it meanssending them twice.

It is kind of you Tabbi, to "Forget" this trade and go on, but nomatter what you decide, the trade is not finished until both parties receiveand are happy with the pins promised.

I am glad I did what I did, because I know that the other person is happywith our trade. I know have a good relationship with a trader that is awesometo deal with, online as well as in person!

Again just my two cents worth.

Vicki

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In this case I would say he is partially responsible. If you know you have issues with your mail it is irresponsible to continue to have people send you their pins until the issue is resolved.

..and how many bad trades had this 'Senior Citizen' made??

It sucks that this happens to you. I remember a while back you said a kid was causing you hastle as well. I'm wishing you the best of luck and hoping that everything turns our right.

p.s. I really wish this particular trader knew how awesome of a trader you are. I'm sure plenty of people could vouch on here for that. You are constantly zapping people, helping them get their most wanted (me included of course), and always have great communication. Its just a shame that you have to go thru this... Why couldn't it happen to a SHARK instead.

If you take training with Disney through their corporate training group one thing they will teach is the motto that "It's not my fault but it IS my problem". I think that's a good motto for customer service in general.