DSF Line UPDATE! 1/30/13

dancecats said:

The issue I have is that DSF is INCONSISTENT with what they say. First they say that people will not be permitted to line up until Thursday evening (what is 'evening' by the way?). This later is clarified to mean 6.00 pm on Thursday. Then they change their mind ... because of the risk of stampeding at 6.00 pm, people can begin lining up at 'anytime' on Thursday (what exactly does 'anytime' mean?). This later is clarified (on the phone) to mean that nobody can line up before 8.00 am. Fine ... except that people started lining up around ... what? ... 10.00 pm (?), which is not even Thursday. This pin release might go down in history as the first one to have the full 150 people lined up before the time when DSF has officially said the line up could start. My timeline might be a little off, DSF has changed their mind so many times, I can't keep up, but I think you can understand my point and the resulting problems.

My concern: if DSF doesn't enforce what they say, what's to stop people from leaving one release and getting back in line for the next one immediately? Sure, it'll be a long wait, but they'll be guaranteed to get a wristband, right? Giving the bands out early will clear out the sidewalks, sure, but it will just make the scenario I described (absurd as it seems now) all the more likely - especially for an insanely popular release. Why should people listen to when DSF says to come and line up when they can line up early and (even better) get the wristbands early?

I understand what DSF was trying to accomplish with these wristbands, negate the purpose of campouts. But isn't it ironic in attempting to eliminate campouts, they are generating campouts. Has anyone ever heard of a three night campout for a pin release before? I'm including the night of the actual release in that count as some people live too far away from DSF to commute home and back to the store Saturday morning.

At this point, I'm not at DSF and I don't see much point in going because I don't think I'd get a wristband now (and I can't really afford to lose 3 days to a campout, it's hard enough going to an overnight pin release). I'm not complaining, I will get my pin eventually (even if I have to buy it on the secondary market). For me, three day campout = no work. No work = no money for pins. Therefore, it becomes a no brainer; I must skip the three day campout and pursue the secondary market and be grateful that I can afford to do so.

My complaint is with DSF. They have a system that clearly does not work (or work they way they had intended). I don't know how to fix it (for every fix, there will be a way around it), but it clearly isn't working now. To those of you who are braving the cold and crowds, stay safe and stay warm - and post pics of the pins when you get them.

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I agree w/ u +1,000,000,000,000 with everything u just said! Pretty what u described as is exactly what happened these last 3 days when I called DSF to check in about times bc they kept changing so much. It was so frustrating bc I kept trying to arrange times w/ Aquata on when to go, and then this happens!! DSF really should have been clearer from the getco about times... but then again there may have been so many inquiries that they accommodated and changed at the last moments to prevent riots from breaking point on Hollywood Blvd. I must admit that in all my pin trading time (on and off since 2000), I NEVER have heard of any pin release become this bad before (I just learned about DSF within these last 6 months so I am probably naive and entirely wrong). This makes the PoDM releases look like nothing compared to what's going on now! I'm just in disbelief and awe of what happened in just these last 24 hours...

I also agree w/ what u said about lost time; mad props to the ppl who are braving the over 30 hour campout, but that is a HUGE inconvenience to many, if not all ppl. If I went to go to line now I would miss other obligations and work, and ur right: no work=no pin money for other releases, so I just have to face the fact that I'm 99.9% not going to have the pins both for my collection and trading (and I had a GREAT trade in the works too for two of the pins!:facepalm If by some divine miracle there aren't 150 ppl there by noon tomorrow, I'll humor the thought (and I say that very lightly) of going and waiting in line and calling into work on friday... but to try to be positive... 1. I can now use the "freed" up $200 I was going to spend on 2/2 and maybe purchase other wanted pins of mine (like a SitS PoDM) or something nice for me (nails, wax, etc.) and 2. just go back to the drawing board on the trade I was going to do and revise the trade w/ the trader and maybe we can agree on something maybe not, at least I tried. Plus if I'm going to spend $100 on pins such as these... I would actually much rather get something I TRULY want and really have to put money down for in my collection... looks like I may be able to get some other PoDMs I want off the Bay after all lol Don't get my wrong I would have loved to have gotten these pins for myself... at retail cost... I can't really see myself paying more than $100 for any one of these pins or the set even, and I'm okay with that.

I also agree that hopefully DSF will also go back to the drawing board on what to do and try something else bc it's pretty clear both traders and themselves are frustrated that stuff isn't working according to plan (boy the workers are going to get a lovely surprise tomorrow when they see the alley lol). It's all a trial and error process; looks like this system isn't going to work much longer I do agree that A LOT of issues would be resolved if the edition sizes increased, even a LE of 1000 to 750 would work too. ::looks around:: can we drop that off in the DSF suggestion box if there is one? lol

On a side note... if the Kevin PTD is somehow released within these next 3 days I will be so pissed! Yes very cool and great for the ppl who are already in line, bad and sucky for those of us who are not But if they start lumping most wanted pins like that all the time (e.g these chocolate boxes and kevin ptd, Stitch BT w/ Tangled BT) more chaos would ensue and DSF would be in trouble on so many levels it's not even funny how bad that could be... eeesh :/

Molly said:

It is unbelievable that they (DSF) would allow people to sleep not one but two nights in an alley! I understand the desire to collect (total addict) but at what point has it gone too far? I'm sorry and it may just be me, I would not sleep outside in an alley in West Hollywood for any pin and that includes my absolutely most lusted for grail pins! I have been reading about kids out there as little as 3 or 4 and I swear I would call the police on those parents, if you are one of them shame on you I will say it straight to your face you are a bad parent.

I will not be buying/supporting this type of collecting and am actually considering boycotting all DSF pins from now on. Bad business and dangerous behavior that is condoned by this retailer is atrocious. Maybe they think it draws attention to the store? Maybe they think it will make them more money? I think they are going to be victim of a large, dare I say HUGE lawsuit whether real or concocted because they are responsible for the safety of every single person that they made contact with tonight. If you stub your toe, they have to pay you. If you get mugged or drugged same thing they are legally obligated to compensate. There are probably also some strict laws about sleeping in the streets that if the police were alerted that the business not only knows they are there they GAVE THEM BRACELETS TO STAY THERE, there would most likely be a large fine imposed.

Please stay safe/warm all of you out there and maybe ask yourself if waiting in line in the cold, dark, dirty and dangerous streets is this a good use of your time? What if this was the last day of your life or even the last week, would you make the same choices? Tomorrow is never promised to any of us and I know for me collecting has brought me a lot of happiness, not to say that the behavior of some that I have encountered hasn't cast a shadow because it has and if and when it becomes more about greed and people looking to flip everything I will surely find something else to do with my time and money.

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+ 100, 000, 000, 000, 000

I thoroughly thoroughly agree and it isn't just sour grapes either. I have attended soda fountain releases myself and I've debated many times in the past turning in parents to child protective services for child endangerment. Willfully placing children in this sort of dangerous environment in an alleyway in the middle of downtown Hollywood, sometimes against their will, in 40º weather constitutes criminal child endangerment and neglect. Should anyone wish to challenge this I will be more than happy to supply the California Penal Code regarding child endangerment.

My wife and I have witnessed child endangerment at the soda fountain in the past. At 1 particular release, a parent made their child stay in line for over 14 hours even though the child was extremely sick and vomited several times in line. When will this stop? When someone gets hurt? When someone gets mugged, or worse? There are some pretty sketchy people that hang out in Hollywierd. I stopped going to releases because I began to feel that while they were worth the time of which i have plenty they were unsafe and not worth the risk involved just for a pin or two.

Disney is going to eat it at some point. It is not a matter of if but when. I had not even considered that Disney is likely violating city ordinance by allowing and permitting people to live illegally without a permit on their property. Also, consider that DSF managers have stated in the past that the alley is private property owned by Disney. That means they qre also LIABLE for anything that happens to anyone there. I too smell a huge, stinking lawsuit against Disney in the future. Gaurds just make it worse; it proves that Disney is aware of an inherent risk posed to guests from which they must be protected. Bad, bad juju.

Regardless of my opinion, I do have many friends waiting there tonight and I do wish you the best of luck and I hope that you all can stay safe.

Phsyco pixie we need your ice cream!! Plus Jordan is having a great time! Hes made a wonderful trade with gis and is having a blast with marissa, he loves everyone, team pin a colada, yay wonderful couple, finally jordan grew tired and is all warm and bundled up, right next to his mama. For breakfast were having cereal bars oranges and juice. Everyone is well protected in this wondeful 100+ mob of fabilous traders I just met echo harmony and saw couple of dorks (lots of love to you both) we played disney music trivia.

I hope we get the bracelets tomorrow since the line is almost full, heres to hoping, but this is my first DSF camp out and I love that I have met so many either again or for the first time.sleep well all!

This post really needs ice cream bad its getting viscious. Mabey consider closing it mods.

Jrdnsmom said:

This post really needs ice cream bad its getting viscious. Mabey consider closing it mods.

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Really u think so...? I think this one is much more civil compared to the last two that were shut down.... I think we all learned our lesson and r being civil right..? Or did I miss something...? ^^;

Geoff said:

+ 100, 000, 000, 000, 000

I thoroughly thoroughly agree and it isn't just sour grapes either. I have attended soda fountain releases myself and I've debated many times in the past turning in parents to child protective services for child endangerment. Willfully placing children in this sort of dangerous environment in an alleyway in the middle of downtown Hollywood, sometimes against their will, in 40º weather constitutes criminal child endangerment and neglect. Should anyone wish to challenge this I will be more than happy to supply the California Penal Code regarding child endangerment.

My wife and I have witnessed child endangerment at the soda fountain in the past. At 1 particular release, a parent made their child stay in line for over 14 hours even though the child was extremely sick and vomited several times in line. When will this stop? When someone gets hurt? When someone gets mugged, or worse? There are some pretty sketchy people that hang out in Hollywierd. I stopped going to releases because I began to feel that while they were worth the time of which i have plenty they were unsafe and not worth the risk involved just for a pin or two.

Disney is going to eat it at some point. It is not a matter of if but when. I had not even considered that Disney is likely violating city ordinance by allowing and permitting people to live illegally without a permit on their property. Also, consider that DSF managers have stated in the past that the alley is private property owned by Disney. That means they qre also LIABLE for anything that happens to anyone there. I too smell a huge, stinking lawsuit against Disney in the future. Gaurds just make it worse; it proves that Disney is aware of an inherent risk posed to guests from which they must be protected. Bad, bad juju.

Regardless of my opinion, I do have many friends waiting there tonight and I do wish you the best of luck and I hope that you all can stay safe.

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Agreed, agreed, agreed! I put this on their FB page and I'll put it here too...

There is no way that anyone can justify making young children camp out in the cold in an alley in Hollywood. It IS child endangerment pure and simple, I don't care how you argue it. My friend told me that there's reports that children as young as 5 or 6 are there now. Hollywood at night is not a safe place. Last weekend when I camped at DSF, my friend and I observed a strange man following us around who was NOT a pin collector. He followed us into the pizza shop and out again and even followed us into line and walked up and down the line once or twice, staring at us. It was thoroughly creepy and unnerving.
Even in a mass of people, that does not guarantee your child's safety. Sometimes with so many people, it's easy to lose sight of a small child in a crowd. I know there's some wonderful people there who keep an eye on things but they can't keep an eye on everyone at all times. Besides, many times there are people in these lines who are completely unknown to others. How do you or anyone else know for sure that there isn't that one person who may have ill intentions when you aren't looking or fall asleep? Also, it is not unheard of to hear of someone's small child getting abducted even in a large mass of people. Happens at grocery stores and malls all the time. The rule for DSF pin line ups really should be no children under 13. I'm sorry if this ticks some people off here. Yes, I know the pins are can be expensive to obtain on the second market. I also know that small children "love Rapunzel/Stitch/whatever character" but as a parent? Their safety comes first. It is YOUR responsibility to put pins second to their well being and keep them out of potentially dangerous situations. Sorry, just how it is. If I had small children, DSF camp outs would be out of the question for me and I wouldn't even have to think twice about that. I'd explain to my children that we can't always get everything we want and that there would be other Rapunzel/Stitch/whatever character pins to collect in the future. There's been some instances I've witnessed in the past, based off the things small children in line have been overheard saying, that I would question if the pins are even for the child or more for the adult.

Also wanted to second that to those camping... BE SAFE and be warm. Best of luck on this long camp out

Edit: Also, I'm not calling anyone out. This post is strictly in reference to Geoff's post and something I feel very strongly about.

Jrdnsmom said:

This post really needs ice cream bad its getting viscious. Mabey consider closing it mods.

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This can only be seen as viscous if you are guilty of abusing a child by having them sleep in an alley. If you would like me to direct a Child Protection Agent to said alley I will be more than happy to and I assure you that they will be happy to point out the obvious.... CHILDREN SHOULD NOT BE SLEEPING IN AN ALLEY!!! It is FREEEEEEZING outside, there are hundreds of people out there and oh one more thing YOU ARE SLEEPING IN AN ALLEY!!!! As an adult you have the right to choose the lengths that you will go to in order to purchase something whether to keep it for yourself or to re-sell it as your job, as a child you don't. How about you ask your KID if they would rather SLEEP IN AN ALLEY and wait in line for two *#@%*&$% DAYS or be at home and see what he/she says. You should be arrested if greed/obsession has interfered with such a basic understanding of child rearing.

jrdnsmom said:

phsyco pixie we need your ice cream!! Plus jordan is having a great time! Hes made a wonderful trade with gis and is having a blast with marissa, he loves everyone, team pin a colada, yay wonderful couple, finally jordan grew tired and is all warm and bundled up, right next to his mama. For breakfast were having cereal bars oranges and juice. Everyone is well protected in this wondeful 100+ mob of fabilous traders i just met echo harmony and saw couple of dorks (lots of love to you both) we played disney music trivia.

I hope we get the bracelets tomorrow since the line is almost full, heres to hoping, but this is my first dsf camp out and i love that i have met so many either again or for the first time.sleep well all!

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It is now 4AM in the morning and you have a child in an alley in West Hollywood, FOR GOD SAKE HAVE MERCY AND TAKE THAT KID HOME. If your child is school aged and missing school that is yet another law you are breaking.

Mali87 most everyone is fine say for the threats against the familes is not necessary, lots of love Mali

Molly im going to ask that you kindly stop threatening the families here. And there are no kids 3 or 4 years old out here, I dont know where your getting your info from.have a wonderful day.

ok this thread just got way too serious.....say we move on?

I am not there and was simply stating what other people are saying online about the age of the children out there. That aside I am not "threatening" anyone I am sure you are hoping the lingo will justify closing the thread but nothing I have said constitutes a threat. If you are not breaking the law or endangering a child why would having the police or CPS come out there be a threat? If in fact it is not against the law to have a child SLEEP IN AN ALLEY, miss school to STAND IN LINE FOR TWO DAYS FOR A PIN then you have nothing to worry about. IF however you are breaking the law and admitting it in writing at 5AM on a forum then this thread should remain open as to not interfere with said law right?

I will not continue to engage. This seems like a very black and white issue and ANYONE that supports or attempts to justify a child being in the streets in an ALLEY no matter what their age in the middle of the night is simply wrong PERIOD.

Nathan95 said:

My 8th grade math teacher was a 27 year veteran of the navy and served as a navy SEAL for 12 years. He was taken prisoner of war in Vietnam and ended his career in the military with 3 purple hearts and a gold star. He taught middle school algebra until he passed at the age of 87. You know how he lived to be 87? He minded his own business!!! You have no business telling people how to parent their children.

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Clearly someone needs to let them know that having a child in the cold, in the streets and waiting in line for TWO DAYS is abuse because it is!! I GUARANTEE that the child is not there because they want to be, they will not be KEEPING anything that they are FORCED to purchase and the law is very clear on this matter IT IS CHILD ABUSE/ENDANGERMENT!

I honestly cannot believe that anyone would defend such despicable behavior, unless you are doing it too. Again SHAME ON YOU and anyone that uses children as a means to make money. I swear no matter how many people support this it is wrong wrong wrong wrong and yes WRONG.

Just to be crystal clear I am not disgruntled or jealous. I do not collect Tangled or Up, I have never cried about a pin, my objection is 100% about the child, nothing more.

Hey nathan! " waving to nathan"

I dont know where you are in line but I did see you a couple times tonight.

Molly said:

Clearly someone needs to let them know that having a child in the cold, in the streets and waiting in line for TWO DAYS is abuse because it is!! I GUARENTEE that the child is not there because they want to be, they will not be KEEPING anything that they are FORCED to purchase and the law is very clear on this matter

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I'm not saying its right nor am I saying its wrong. I will say its nobody's obligation to tell someone the right and wrongs of parenting over a pin forum. If you wanna talk pins that's great but there's more appropriate forums for the point you're trying to get across

Nathan95 said:

I'm not saying its right nor am I saying its wrong. I will say its nobody's obligation to tell someone the right and wrongs of parenting over a pin forum. If you wanna talk pins that's great but there's more appropriate forums for the point you're trying to get across

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You are right, it is a pin forum and the discussion was about this V-day release. Also, part of this discussion was how DSF is handling things badly and the legal implications (if any) might be arising from the camp-outs.

If children are indeed endangered and laws are broken to get few pins, then that might be one of the accusations against DSF. I think it makes sense to point that out. I think DSF should raise the age limit from 4 to maybe say 12 or so. But that is only my opinion, so don't bite me for it

What I do not agree with, is publically attacking other members and giving them parenting pointers and accusing them of being greedy.

Buy them on eBay. Honestly, 31 hours on a street alley while you take time off work and pull your kids out of school? People need some perspective. It really does frighten me.

eyhahndisney said:

31+ hours just for a wristband so you can come back again 24 hours later and get in line to purchase . . . there has to be a better way!

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Nathan95 said:

You have no business telling people how to parent their children.

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When parents are endangering the well-being of their children (by breaking laws) then you have the right to advocate for that child. And with all do respect, you're still a kid (minor) yourself.

I'm glad for those of you who made it to the line and will have the opportunity to purchase pins. Just be safe and remember that at the end of the day these are just pins and its not worth a fight, your health, or ANY risks. Nonetheless, I know you're all probably super excited for your pins. I feel bad for those of you that could have gotten there in time had DSF released consistent info. It's all good though...there will be MANY MANY MANY more pins to come in the future. I mean really...Disney pins don't look to be losing interest anytime soon and production surely isn't slowing down according to my wallet lol

Now I think it might be appropriate for a mediator to close the thread. The conversation is just way too heated.

As a parent and a pin collector, no pin is worth me taking my child and having them sleep in a cold alley for a pin.

I think they should raise the age to at least 12 (mine are 5 and 6). NO child should be put through that.

If I was there and saw a small child out there your damn sure I would be calling the police. Call me a snitch, nosy, busy body.

If you don't like my opinion feel free to PM me.

Nathan95 said:

My 8th grade math teacher was a 27 year veteran of the navy and served as a navy SEAL for 12 years. He was taken prisoner of war in Vietnam and ended his career in the military with 3 purple hearts and a gold star. He taught middle school algebra until he passed at the age of 87. You know how he lived to be 87? He minded his own business!!! You have no business telling people how to parent their children.

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I seem to recall you telling me this and it was your grandpa, not your math teacher.

markheardjr said:

I seem to recall you telling me this and it was your grandpa, not your math teacher.

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I remembered that too, but did not want to point out .. :lol:

ThestitchITCH said:

97 in line. People who ordered pre sales. Better call your dealers!

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Yup! This is why you don't do presales!