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Trade Auctions...People bidding for others and / or rooting for them to win...

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Trade Auctions...People bidding for others and / or rooting for them to win...

I agree with this quote and well said. My thought on this matter is this and I'm going to keep it short since I have to get ready for work. As I remember pins that you bid have to be on hand. Even if you let someone know through PM that you will help them and send them a pin so they can add to their bid, the pin is not on hand and you have to wait for that pin to be sent to you before you can send the pins off that you bidded which can hold things up. If you really want to help them out then bid on the pin yourself with the pins you have. If you win then you can zap the person you wanted to help out and I think that would be a greater surprise. I don't know if that made any since but I will see everyone later. Have a magical day
 

I see the point here. However in the past when someone has added to one of my bids, if i won, that person just shipped directly to the auctioneer, thus I never had the pin in my hand. And believe me... Folks who help out others DO get noticed. You would not believe how many people have sent me nominations for the zap mayhem. Many of them are names I have never met!
 
On a side note, I hear about cliques but cannot spot them?
I think what others have said, to zap the person who originally helped
You. But what if you have the pins the auctioneer is looking for?
I think it is ok to help a friend but from now on I think pms will be the way to go

So I think add ons are fine, I just think publicly throwing them out there might
Put others at a feeling of unease.
 
I've never had anyone help me in an auction, and before today I have only helped out one other person and while it was our plan to do it through PMs time ran short and the other bidders had so many people helping them that it almost became a mute point. The person I helped today, I do not know, but I saw that the pin was on her grail list and I knew that I didn't have enough pins to bid to win the pin so I helped her. Would I have preferred to do it privately, yes, but as I said I don't really know her and she wasn't online.

I am in agreement that cheering someone on can be hurtful to others, no one likes to feel excluded, I know I often feel that way in the pin world and it stings, but it is what it is. I no longer live near a park, when I did I got burned so many times it made it difficult to want to get to know people or trade in person and pin traders, at least in CA can be very intimidating, and I can be very shy around people I don't know. For all of these reasons and probably a lot more I don't know people personally, I have only made 2 real friends and have to cut off ties with people that showed me that pins were more important than friendship and at the end of the day, I come here for information about pins, any friends that are made are just icing. As much as I hate cliques they exist everywhere and really why would you want to be friends with someone who wouldn't have you at their dinner table. I am not interested in surface friendships or the kind where someone talks about you behind your back or you or the other person is only interested in what you can do for them and sadly I know that there are a lot of these kind of relationships that exist not only in this hobby, but any other hobby as well. And while like I said it does sting when I see other people being so friendly or getting zapped or getting help bids, I try to remind myself that one real friendship is worth 10 superficial ones. (I am not talking about anyone specific, these are just generalizations, so please don't let anyone take offense.)

There is something said that did bother me, I can't remember whose posting it was, but it was something along the lines of the unfairness of this hobby and what specifically bothered me was that it's not fair because some people have more pins, better pins, etc. And this bothers me because it is completely fair. If I or someone else has better pins or more pins, it's not because the pin fairy came to my house and not yours it's because I have spent a lot of money obtaining my pins and all of us have that same opportunity. Are people like me who live farther away from pin releases at a disadvantage, yes, especially with the lack of pins on DS.com, but I really don't think it's fair for newer traders to complain that they don't have "good" traders as we all decide how much money we are willing to invest in this hobby, the less you invest, the less you have. I know how hard it is to get started and to build up a collection of good traders, but you can't say it's unfair, that's like saying it's unfair that you're 25 and I'm 37, it is what it is and it can't be helped or changed.

Just my 2 cents. I know that the last part kind of digressed from the subject, but I don't like having to feel bad because I might have better pins than someone else. I've spent A LOT of money to obtain the pins I have and I know that there are people that have been collecting longer than me and have better pins than me and have spent a lot more money than me, but I'm not going to complain, do I wish I had some of their pins, sure, but I'm not going to guilt anyone for what they have and I don't. We should all be thankful that we even have the luxury of pin collecting. I know many of us are broke, but clearly not so much so that we can't afford this frivolous hobby and give it time, everyone who has a great collection of pins had to work at it, and spend money to make it so.

I know I'm wordy, sorry, just try spending an afternoon with me, it's like hanging out with the micro-machine guy. I'll shut up now. if you missed it, I agree that perhaps in an effort to save other's feelings, bidding for someone through PM is much more considerate. And if that can't be done than adding the bid without any additional comments is preferred. I don't think we should be cheering people on other than the auctioneer.

Alright my additional one cent and done.
 
Time to join in this thread of shenanigans (it's my word of the day so I had to use it lol xD):


Nothing in the world is 100% fair for everyone, auctions and pin trading are no different. I understand adding to people's bids upsets some people HOWEVER I think that those located in FL or CA should understand why. People not located by DSF or either park have next to no way to get great traders (as Mad Hatter said earlier) to bid besides buying them for 4-5x the price minimum off 3rd parties (I'm talking about the really good traders, like PODMs, etc.). This makes bidding very hard for those people because in order to even afford their bid in the first place, they had to spend 6-7x the amount you did on that same pin. So this automatically makes things a little unfair since a person not located by a place to buy pins is bidding their pin which they spent $50.00 on while you bid the same pin but you only spent $12.00 (obviously this varies with which pin we're talking about, etc.).

I don't mean to incite a huge argument over where people are located, I'm just trying to express a side of the coin that takes into account why some people have such a hard time bidding and thus adding bids isn't always bad.

I'm still against openly stating who you think should win though, that isn't fully right. I can see how that would annoy many people because you aren't really contributing, if you wanted to bump, just say "friendly bump good luck everyone I know this auction will be great" or do what I have seen Kristine do a lot...add a gif of you eating popcorn haha xD However, just stating who you think should win doesn't increase their chances of winning or does it help those who aren't winning, it just puts you on a team against those who aren't on that same side...

broncobilly83 said:
2 pin collectors publicly pool their pins to bid on an auction and win. Who owns the pin? :anxious:
Click to expand...

Technically, they both share the pin, but most likely the one who really wants it will just be zapped by the other person or told to keep it.


The problem with this is that, even from the auctioneers stand point, you'll never actually know if the bid you received was from one or many because they can do private PMs and if they win, they could do 1-night shipping and various things so that the person receives it immediately, even the auctioneer might not know.

Another problem is, if it was reduced to secret bidding, conspiracy theories would run rampant. Think of this scenario:

- Pin Trader A joins DPF in Jan 2013, has only rack and HM pins for trade
- Pin Trader A's grail goes up for auction Feb 2013 and Pin Trader A is sad because they can't compete
- All of a sudden Pin Trader A bids Tangled BT

There is no way to prove that Pin Trader A doesn't have the Tangled BT (if asked for a photo, the person bidding for them can send it and time-stamp it, everything). Who's to say they didn't have it all along but not want to tell people? Instead, conspiracy theories of who is helping who and why they are helping them would just go everywhere or people would harbor them or talk about them in chat and such and that is when cliques would really show. There really isn't a way to make this whole auction thing 100% fair for every side honestly
 
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Hate to bring back this thread.... But I think it is needed at the moment.

Please take consideration for the other bidders when bidding for your friend(s).
 
Holy Rsserected thread batman!

Ok. as this seems to re-occur on some of the comments I will ask this question...

What cliques? Calling those small groups of friends a "clique" implies a group that is exclusive, and unfair to the rest of the community. People hear or see the word "clique" and think of those groups of popular kids in high school who pick on the other kids. From my experience here on DPF there are no "cliques." If it does I have not seen any massively obvious idiocy coming from them.

There are groups, yes... There are always going to be people who tend to hang out with, chat with trade with, eachother. Heck, I am a part of a GROUP of people who are here in so cal, we hang out, go to pin parties, converse in the chat room... Etc.

main concern raised with this thread: bidding for others.

  • It is in the best interest of the auctioneer to allow others to assist eachother. The auctioneer is more likely to get a phenomenal over bid if multiple people are assisting one person to win.
  • It is not in the community spirit to publicly "root" for someone, because it makes the other bidders feel left out or excluded.
  • It is best to assist the bidder privately via PM. either by contacting the auctioneer for a "anonymous" bid, or by contacting the bidder and generously offering pins to add to their bid.
  • I do not see them adding a rule to dis-allow bidding for others. However so far, if an auctioneer puts a rule in their auction stating "no adding to others, helping others." It is respected.
 
This whole subject really irks me in general because it just sounds...so whiny.

This kind of stuff happens all the times irl at ptns and the pin trading tables. Somebody has friends, okay they want that pin...well, do you have anything to trade? NOPE your friend comes in and helps! It happens not only with friends but with couples too! I don't see anybody saying anything when a couple gets each other's help to trade so i just...don't get it.

IDK basically if your friends are awesome enough to put things and bid for you, then yay! If not, well no big deal. Half the time, it's not like people are begging for others to help, y'know?
 
I'm on the fence about this. I did participate in this, simply because I was already losing the auction and I figured it would be a nice thing to do. But I hadn't really looked through the eyes of the other bidders until now. It is hard to form an opinion on because the basis of the act is purely out of kindness, however I do have a few things that I don't think are right.

First of all, I really don't appreciate people rooting for a specific person. It makes the rest of the bidders feel alienated and it is hurtful. And although it may not be directly said, bidding pins for others is a blatant way of rooting for a specific person to win. And then often other members, again, out of kindness, jump on the bandwagon and add to that one members bid as well, and it sends a clear message to the other bidders that "We want this person to win" ergo, we don't want you to win.

And that is where my second problem is - feeling guilty about bidding against one of these bids. Normally, when people bid for others, there may be some sort of message about how nice they are, how much they deserve it, etc., which is why various members are trying to help them out. (And even if there isn't any of this said, with so many people supporting this person, it gives the obvious impression that they're well liked, and of course that is so because they're a nice member.) I'm sure that's all lovely and true, but now I have to feel guilty about bidding against them, which is really not at all fair. All these people are hoping this person they're supporting and bidding pins for wins, and if I bid against them, I look like the bad guy. I have to go against this person described as so wonderful and so deserving of this pin (which they probably are, but hey, it's more than likely that all of the bidders are just as nice and deserving), and that just feels awkward because everyone is rooting for them and you look like a jerk bidding against them.

Although it's an extremely nice gesture, bidding for others implies you rooting for one specific person, and that hurts the feelings of the rest of the bidders. And now, the other bidders are in an awkward position because it makes them feel like they're obligated to let that other person win or possibly even support them. It's like peer pressure - all these people are supporting this one person, do I now have to support them/let them win so I don't look like a jerk, or bid against them and upset all these people and ruin their nice gesture? It's not fair that anyone should feel hurt because a crowd is rooting for a specific person through bidding for them, and it's not fair that they are than felt pressured to go with the crowd to support that person, or risk looking like a jerk.

I know that bids for others are out of kindness, but they do hurt the other bidder's feelings, and if you really want to support this specific member, I'd suggest doing it privately:
1) PM the person you wish to support and list the pin(s) you'd like to add to their bid
2) Have them reply with an agreement/disagreement
3) The original bidder PMs the auctioneer, letting them know that should they win the auction, the addition pin(s) would be mailed from a different member
4) The original bidder adds the pins to their bid in the auction thread, so the auctioneer can have the entire bid in one place, but do not indicate which pins are in your possession and which pins, upon winning would be sent by another member. (The auctioneer already knows about this, and not mentioning it avoids hurting other bidder's feelings). Simply list them all as your own, single bid.
5) Should this person win the auction, they send the pins they have in their possession to the auctioneer and the person that offered to bid the additional pins sends those pins to the auctioneer, and the auctioneer sends the auction pin to the original bidder.

This private way would eliminate any implication of people rooting for a specific person and thus hoping another member does not win, and would then also avoid the "peer pressure/going against the crowd" aspect as the other bidders have no idea, and they really don't need to know anyway. If you want to add to a person's bid, it should be between you, the person you're supporting, and the auctioneer.
 
I much prefer the method of doing it behind the scenes also. I have helped several people out by adding to their bids because I like them and have had wonderful dealings with them in the past. I have also joined into a very large auction to help out another member because it seemed like she was being ganged up on by well meaning people. I was lucky enough to have a lot of pins the auctioneer wanted and we were able to win it. So while people mean well by adding to others bids, it can cause some hurt feelings. Especially to people who have not been here long or don't have a lot of pins to bid. I believe it is much nicer to all bidders to do it behind the scenes and then nobody gets their feelings hurt because they may be more liked then others.
 
I need to read up on these trade auctions that you're all talking about :hsd:

But my first thoughts are, if the purpose is to make people feel bad, then sure, go and help them openly and root for them. If the purpose is to make sure the auctioneer gets the best deal for his or her pin(s), then take it behind the scenes so no one has to feel sad about it.
 
I think it's just a part of life as anything else. People who are more outspoken and are on here a lot are gonna have more friends and are vocal about the pins they want. If people see you on the forum constantly saying you want a pin it's gonna get noticed. I collect Pocahontas, tangled, and brave and Ive once in a while posted asking for help with specific pins and my posts normally get viewed and never commented on but I'll see someone else post the same request and get a bunch of comments for good luck and help finding their pin. I'm not really upset about it, I'm not as vocal on here about asking for pins cause well... I know I'm not gonna get the help. I've missed out twice on one of my big grails because when a co op goes up someone else calls holds for other members so other members can't get it. It sucks, but it's life.
 
I can see how doing it behind the scenes might help with hurt feelings, but it also lends a "shady" aspect to it, like helping is somehow wrong. I do think it would hurt my feelings to be in competition where other people are helping out my competition, but I kinda think thats just life, you kknow?
 
The bottom line is: You cannot control what other members do. Even if we sit here and say "it is morally incorrect to publicly bid for others," members will still do it here because not everyone reads this thread. The only way to prevent this from happening in the future is to make it a new rule. Anyone with me? A rule stating that no more public bids for people will be accepted on any auction. Members must PM the person they want to bid for and ask permission, and then the bidder must PM the auctioneer and ask their permission, for any pin added, as CrashMyParty suggested. As she suggested, this way no one would get hurt feelings, no one would even have to know it was happening. I think a rule is the only way to stop this discussion from continuing, and from this issue hurting more individuals.

It is true, people will always think of others for certain pins over other people. For example, we all know who some of the Tangled collectors are, but we do not know all of them. Does this hurt the others' feelings when no one thinks of them first for a co-op or auction? OF COURSE it does. But no one comments asking for someone to hold the pin in question for the "more known collector" out of malice. They do it because they think they are being kind and considerate to someone they know is passionate. It is impossible to hold one pin for a group of people haha. Sometimes it hurts our feelings when someone is thought of over us for a collection we hold dear, but it isn't possible for every member to know every member's every collection, and to think of them always when something comes up. You know?
 
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Apples and oranges!! I agree there is no problem with helping somebody get a pin in person, as there is no other competition for the pin, in person! How many times, using your example do you see people competing to get a pin at the same time from the same trader throwing up offers to outbid the other person. This just does not happen in person! Totally different scenarios.
 
I never saw this thread originally but it's interesting that it appears again. I'm currently bidding in an auction where I'm competing against someone who has others adding to their bid and cheering them on.

Gotta say it doesn't feel real good. It gives the illusion of the auction being yourself against the rest of the board.

I don't mind losing an auction. I just prefer to lose against one person, not a group.
 
I agree with crashmyparty. Trade auctions have taken an interesting turn lately. Definitely in favor of lowballing the auctioneer in many cases. I've seen it at least 6-7 times in the last few weeks. People "retract" bids because they feel bad competing with other people. I thought that wasn't even allowed? I reallly want to auction off one of the new custom pin books I'm making (which are uber cute IMO!) but I'm pretty hesistant knowing that my hours of work could potentially end with not so exciting results. I know it's a gamble but it seemed like it used to pay off fairly. Now? Hmmmmm....

I think when bidding on an auction, you should think to yourself "if this was my pin, would I be OK with trading it for what I'm bidding (final bid, not starting bid)?". Ultimate goal is for both parties to be happy right?
 
I don't do the auctions nor do I bid, or even visit the page. I did find this thread very interesting and have my own opinions, but since I don't participate, no need to post them, as how I feel has been posted by a couple of others. I am thrilled tho to basically see no drama. Thank you!! It was interesting to read everyone's opinions.
 
In another perspective, I was going to bid on a few pins but saw the "gang" auction happening and my thought was what is the point on bidding? The first thing that came into my head was, if you outbid the "gang" then they will label you as being malevolent because the person they are trying to help is not getting the pin. Likewise, if you are the auctioneer and your thread turns into a "gang" auction you feel the pressure to give in to their demands fearing retaliation (I've seen people quit pin trading because of this). I use the term "gang" loosely because it is what it feels like. It alienates some, makes others feel like outsiders and it intimidates others. Not very pin trading friendly at all.
 


Unfortunately, this just happened to us yesterday! And although I don't blame anyone specifically on my auction since many people participate in auctions in this manner, i think overall it is something to think about as a community. I don't think i will be doing auctions anymore....not just because of this, but they seem to have lost their overall effect! And I said yesterday on my thread, I think PM a person and offering them a pin to add to their bid is the way to go. It keeps the auction thread objective and keeps others from bowing out of the auction.
 
As everyone knows I suffer from depression pretty bad, I have been doing real good, But something really small and had nothing to do with pins!! got under my skin and started chewing, I tried to ignore it and it got the best of me and I lost control, It was all in my head and I apologised, Yes I had friends helping me bid but again it had nothing to do with that, and now I feel this thread was resurected because of that auction and me, and mabey again it's all in my head, but it's there and I feel horrible I feel like a bad person, and many are angry at me, im literlly in tears!

I thought the auctioneer just didn't like me for some reason, I placed a bid and then saw someone else had bid for my son for it ,before I had even placed my bid . but even with the help bids the whole offer was igored, someone backed out because they said they couldn't compete and wished Jordan good luck, I think I got really too excited when I saw it because it was a really cool pin and knew Jordan would love it , I thought it would be fun, but after all the bids and one person backed out (I felt bad about that) the auctioneer said leader board remained the same, I didn't even make the leaderboard??? I wonered why, I PM'd the auctioneer asking where my bid stood, did I even make the leaderboard? That was the only question I had because I was confused because there was only 3 bidders 1 being me so even if I was in 3rd at least I would have liked to have known where I was so I could make changes, But they ignored my message(she later explained why), So now im really thinking, what did I do?? Then another person puts in a bid for Jordan, at this point I feel bad, really bad not because of not knowing but more did I do something wrong to this person, I never once expected to be in first nor did I expect to win just because others are bidding for Jordan, The whole time I was just thinking, Does this person dislike me, I know many don't like me and I would like to know why what I did,but I also know you can't make everyone like you, But in my shoes be where I am, Being hated your whole life growing up having no playmates but 1 and that was not all the time either because every kid would try to get her away from me all the time. I Have become very sensitive, I have a fear of losing friends or not having friends this is the first time in my life I have been able to be social, growing up feeling like my mother hates me and no friends makes life difficult,you try growing up being pushed, shoved, teased, punched, no one to talk to or play with all the way to high school I went to Junior high at a private school to get away from the hate and hoped for a chance to make friends, but nope it followed me there 1 kid knew me and made my life miserable and had all the kids hate me, I never knew why, I have been so happy for a while I had a hard time wen first joined the forum, but soon I was having a great time making friends and doing real good then in one blow I feel hated, and this thread was brought back up because of me! the auction I was bidding on and issues with it had nothing to do with pins! nothing! and the auctioneer and I worked things out, I apologised for destroying her auction and begged for forgivness and wake up seeing this and feeling awkward. Mabey it is not because of me but I feel like it is. Im sorry for everything,

I like helping others when I can, Yes I am helping someone now, but all I said was, and it was written when I added the pins, I always see them dreaming I hope to help make his dream come true good luck -------! and donated pins I have not posted a word since just been watching, I enjoy helping who I can when I can, like zapping in auction, I like everyone and it is not meant to hurt others feelings if I can help everyone I would. I love zapping and helping it makes me happy.

So this is a public apology! if I caused such a ruckess to resurect this thread, and again I apologise to he auctionner, I was not expecting to win, I apologise my issue had nothing to do with my bid or pins, I think we are ok but right now I don't because this thread just happened to pop back up right after our issue, I eel like shizz right now becase I am not one to cause drama and here I did, Im sorry im sorry im sorry!
 
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I dop not feel that it makes the helping "shadey" but i do see how others might feel this way.


This is something I experienced once or twice, but in a slightly different manner. I was being assisted by others to win an auction and another person who was bidding against me sent me a very pointedly passive aggressive PM. the gist of it being "it's not fair to everyone, you need to pull out of the auction or else." They didnt come out and say it, but that was the implied manner.

This person, after i said no and stayed in... Transfered their bid to another person who was bidding, in an effort to out bid me. I think thats fine, when it is done out of kindness and friendship. but their PM and then actions indicated they were only do it to try and spite me, and those who were helping me. This person has sent me rather passively aggressive mean spirited PM's before that event and since then. It is really frustrating because it puts a cloud over the kindness people are demonstrating.

"If you cant say something nice, don't say nuthin' at all."

Basically, in the "spirit" of community;
  1. add bids should be done privately.
  2. if your the one being helped. simple thank yous privately are appropriate, don't rub it in on the auction ok?
  3. If your not the one folks are helping, it is OK to be frustrated, but it is not ok to be mean to others about it.

psycho small print:: these are just my opinions and experiences.... And I am NOT calling anyone specific out in the story above, so dont get all cranky.
 
Janice <3 This thread being brought up was NOT about you. It was resurrected before your auction was even over. I think lately people have been feeling a little icky about trade auctions in general and felt the need to post which brought the thread back to life. I have been watching a few questionable ones the last two weeks. Hakuna Matata! No worries and work back to being happy Janice I'm pretttttty sure that everyone on the forum likes you...ALOT! ha! By the way, I will be PMing you about what you want for your ariel lanyard!
 
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